I love when infertility is showcased in the news in a positive way!!
http://www.aolhealth.com/2011/02/24/fox-news-alisyn-camerota-infertility/
Is everyone as ready for spring as I am? We had a tease of good temperatures these last few weeks; I have been taking long walks, feeling energized and eating healthy foods. Today we have 8 inches of snow; I just want to stay in, eat, drink and be lazy!
Thursday, February 24, 2011
Friday, February 18, 2011
A long night
So I have been doing fancy schmancy google searches all night long and am now even more confused.
Dr. Silber in St. Louis is a world renown RE...you may remember him from an infertility special a few years ago about couples going through IVF...it airs sometimes still on TLC. His website (http://www.infertile.com/) states...
There is no more confused medical care in our field than what is delivered by many urologists to the couple that suffers from "male infertility." In fact, many couples are told to delay the IVF treatment they should have had sooner (because of the wife's advancing age) in order just to wait for some dubious treatment of the male partner to increase his sperm count. Numerous control studies have demonstrated that administering clomid or nutritional supplements to the male does nothing to improve his sperm count, and the often suggested testosterone supplements just lowers rather than raises his sperm count, and may even render him totally sterile.
So what is appropriate treatment for male infertility in an infertile couple? For most men with low sperm counts, there is no treatment which will raise the sperm count, since sperm counts are genetically determined. It is best in cases of low sperm count to go directly to IVF and ICSI (which is injecting sperm into the egg) before the wife becomes so old that her older eggs become a compounding problem. Many physicians will try IUI first, intra-uterine insemination, but this is a waste of time and money. Washing the sperm and inserting it into the uterus will do nothing to get the sperm closer to the egg than sexual intercourse, although it may help the patients to feel like they are "doing something." The correct treatment for low sperm count is to go directly to IVF and ICSI.
Hmm. So maybe 6 months of clomid is a waste of time.
Also, does anyone know anything about mini-ivf? It is supposedly cheaper, produces less but higher quality eggs, and reduces the risk of multiples.
Dr Silber explains it in easy terms...
Think of this simple parable: If you are sitting under an apple tree, and wish to eat the most ripe and ready apples, you have a choice. You can chop down the tree, and look at every apple on the fallen tree to see which ones were ready. Or you can simply try to shake the lower branches and eat the one or two that have fallen. That is the idea of mini-IVF. For many patients, it will remove much of the aggravation and complexity associated with IVF, and also dramatically reduce the cost. But it requires a great deal of sophisticated ability to do well.
All of this information comes after research into antioxidants therapy and improving sperm counts (some studies show improvement, others don't) and state by state infertility insurance.
Here is a question. If we move to a new state in the next couple of years and suddenly have health insurance that includes some sort of infertility treatment, would our male factor be considered a pre-existing condition and not be covered?
Always questions, always. Thanks for helping!
Dr. Silber in St. Louis is a world renown RE...you may remember him from an infertility special a few years ago about couples going through IVF...it airs sometimes still on TLC. His website (http://www.infertile.com/) states...
There is no more confused medical care in our field than what is delivered by many urologists to the couple that suffers from "male infertility." In fact, many couples are told to delay the IVF treatment they should have had sooner (because of the wife's advancing age) in order just to wait for some dubious treatment of the male partner to increase his sperm count. Numerous control studies have demonstrated that administering clomid or nutritional supplements to the male does nothing to improve his sperm count, and the often suggested testosterone supplements just lowers rather than raises his sperm count, and may even render him totally sterile.
So what is appropriate treatment for male infertility in an infertile couple? For most men with low sperm counts, there is no treatment which will raise the sperm count, since sperm counts are genetically determined. It is best in cases of low sperm count to go directly to IVF and ICSI (which is injecting sperm into the egg) before the wife becomes so old that her older eggs become a compounding problem. Many physicians will try IUI first, intra-uterine insemination, but this is a waste of time and money. Washing the sperm and inserting it into the uterus will do nothing to get the sperm closer to the egg than sexual intercourse, although it may help the patients to feel like they are "doing something." The correct treatment for low sperm count is to go directly to IVF and ICSI.
Hmm. So maybe 6 months of clomid is a waste of time.
Also, does anyone know anything about mini-ivf? It is supposedly cheaper, produces less but higher quality eggs, and reduces the risk of multiples.
Dr Silber explains it in easy terms...
Think of this simple parable: If you are sitting under an apple tree, and wish to eat the most ripe and ready apples, you have a choice. You can chop down the tree, and look at every apple on the fallen tree to see which ones were ready. Or you can simply try to shake the lower branches and eat the one or two that have fallen. That is the idea of mini-IVF. For many patients, it will remove much of the aggravation and complexity associated with IVF, and also dramatically reduce the cost. But it requires a great deal of sophisticated ability to do well.
All of this information comes after research into antioxidants therapy and improving sperm counts (some studies show improvement, others don't) and state by state infertility insurance.
Here is a question. If we move to a new state in the next couple of years and suddenly have health insurance that includes some sort of infertility treatment, would our male factor be considered a pre-existing condition and not be covered?
Always questions, always. Thanks for helping!
Why can't we just talk like grown-ups?
Good news! DH got his genetic tests back and all is well! Normal karotype, no Y micro-deletion, no Klinefelters. And so far...no discernible reason for his low sperm count/low to normal testosterone. So WTF? Why is it low? WHY WHY WHY?!?!?
So, I suppose this means no donor sperm, at least not yet. It will be moved to the backburner for now and reserved as more of a back-up option.
DH and I 'talked' this morning about things. I use quotes because really a lot of it was what I call yelling. He says he wasn't yelling, I said I wasn't crying (we were on the phone), we were both lying. We were both happy that the genetic tests were normal, of course. We've agreed we need a sit down with Dr P (urologist). DH said when they talked a few weeks ago he was recommending 6 months of clomid and another drug he couldn't remember (Started with an M? DH thought it was something like misoprop-something? Anybody have a clue?). He said it would take 6-8 months to see any changes. Then we re-evaluate and see if we can get numbers up enough to do IUI or (shocker!) intercourse. Seriously, we have been so knee-deep in infertility shit that the thought of having a child from sex seems laughable. That's something that only happens in the movies, right? ;)
If that doesn't work then it is IVF. So then the money talk began. That's when we always have our fun. I am pro baby, no matter the expense. DH is pro-waiting for God knows how long until we are financially stable.
Now I agree with most of what he says. I wouldn't want to put 20k on the credit card for IVF. Duh, that seems stupid. BUT I think in 9 months to a year we could save up maybe 10k...and I think then going into 10k debt for a 3 cycle plus option is fine. OR we could just do one cycle at around 7-8k and hope for the best. We could definitely have that in 6-12 mos.
THEN DH says, "Let's just wait until we move and try to get a job in a state that has infertility coverage". Umm, we have talked about moving like 1 1/2-2 years from now, IF we can find jobs elsewhere and IF we can sell our house. SO right there, 2 conditions that would have to be met for this to even have a chance of working. And even then the coverage may not be as great as he thinks. AND isn't there sometimes something like a time period before you can even use the benefits? UUUGGHH!
I just know one day I will suddenly be 38, almost eggless, and we will still be talking about when it is right for IVF.
Sorry for the rant. I am just SO fucking sick of infertility causing strife in my marriage.
So, I suppose this means no donor sperm, at least not yet. It will be moved to the backburner for now and reserved as more of a back-up option.
DH and I 'talked' this morning about things. I use quotes because really a lot of it was what I call yelling. He says he wasn't yelling, I said I wasn't crying (we were on the phone), we were both lying. We were both happy that the genetic tests were normal, of course. We've agreed we need a sit down with Dr P (urologist). DH said when they talked a few weeks ago he was recommending 6 months of clomid and another drug he couldn't remember (Started with an M? DH thought it was something like misoprop-something? Anybody have a clue?). He said it would take 6-8 months to see any changes. Then we re-evaluate and see if we can get numbers up enough to do IUI or (shocker!) intercourse. Seriously, we have been so knee-deep in infertility shit that the thought of having a child from sex seems laughable. That's something that only happens in the movies, right? ;)
If that doesn't work then it is IVF. So then the money talk began. That's when we always have our fun. I am pro baby, no matter the expense. DH is pro-waiting for God knows how long until we are financially stable.
Now I agree with most of what he says. I wouldn't want to put 20k on the credit card for IVF. Duh, that seems stupid. BUT I think in 9 months to a year we could save up maybe 10k...and I think then going into 10k debt for a 3 cycle plus option is fine. OR we could just do one cycle at around 7-8k and hope for the best. We could definitely have that in 6-12 mos.
THEN DH says, "Let's just wait until we move and try to get a job in a state that has infertility coverage". Umm, we have talked about moving like 1 1/2-2 years from now, IF we can find jobs elsewhere and IF we can sell our house. SO right there, 2 conditions that would have to be met for this to even have a chance of working. And even then the coverage may not be as great as he thinks. AND isn't there sometimes something like a time period before you can even use the benefits? UUUGGHH!
I just know one day I will suddenly be 38, almost eggless, and we will still be talking about when it is right for IVF.
Sorry for the rant. I am just SO fucking sick of infertility causing strife in my marriage.
Thursday, February 10, 2011
tests
So we are still waiting for DH's test results. He had genetic tests (unsure exactly but I know they were definitely looking for Klinefelter's and micro x deletion) and all the labs required for us to pursue donor sperm (it is so funny that they need his blood for that...it is to check him for all kinds of stds..I guess so that if one of us ended up with something from the sperm we would have proof that we didn't have it before?).
Does anyone know how long it takes to get these genetic tests back? They were drawn early last week.
SO...I guess we have talked, if he has some genetic snafu then we will be able to move forward with ds with clearer heads. I do completely agree with this. Almost every blog I read about ds the man has NO or almost no sperm. DH has sperm, albeit not many and those that are there are lazy. But they're there. So maybe if everything checks out with hubby's genetic makeup it would be silly not to move forward with IVF.
Anyway, just checking in. Here's to a fertile spring and summer 2011 for everyone!!!!
Does anyone know how long it takes to get these genetic tests back? They were drawn early last week.
SO...I guess we have talked, if he has some genetic snafu then we will be able to move forward with ds with clearer heads. I do completely agree with this. Almost every blog I read about ds the man has NO or almost no sperm. DH has sperm, albeit not many and those that are there are lazy. But they're there. So maybe if everything checks out with hubby's genetic makeup it would be silly not to move forward with IVF.
Anyway, just checking in. Here's to a fertile spring and summer 2011 for everyone!!!!
Saturday, January 29, 2011
Questions..
I swear I've asked most of these before but bear with me..I have a few random questions and a few random thoughts..
I am just so sick of all of this. If the fates have decided that we are not meant to have children at all then I just want to know now. I don't want to keep googling things like, "adoption agencies" "ivf success rates" "genetic reasons for low sperm counts" "donor sperm psychological implications" "ivf financing" "antioxidant sperm production" "hormonal reasons for low sperm count".
- I have read about clomid increasing sperm counts and sometimes motility. I have also read however that it does not necessarily improve pregnancy rates. Why is this? Any success stories with actual numbers?
- Reasons for such a low sperm count in DH...physical exam was normal, testosterone slightly low, unsure if any other hormones were tested. Genetic testing next...exactly what tests should be ordered? How long do they take to get back? What do the results mean?
- HOW THE HELL DOES ANYONE EVER AFFORD IVF?
- ahem. That last one should probably read, "How will we ever be able to afford it?". Seriously? Why is it so expensive?
- I just read online about a new study showing taking extra antioxidants improves sperm count and function. Anyone know anything about this? There are about a million antioxidant supplements out there.
- Ummm I have just started to have an interest in adoption. DH has a cousin or friend or someone he knows who had a bad experience and he has said from the beginning, "I just am not comfortable adopting." Do you think that statement is open for discussion or should I just shut the fuck up for now and cross that bridge later if we need to?
I am just so sick of all of this. If the fates have decided that we are not meant to have children at all then I just want to know now. I don't want to keep googling things like, "adoption agencies" "ivf success rates" "genetic reasons for low sperm counts" "donor sperm psychological implications" "ivf financing" "antioxidant sperm production" "hormonal reasons for low sperm count".
Thursday, January 20, 2011
Limbo, how I've missed you
First off I am SOOO far behind on blogs. I have only read sporadically...I am sorry. I am rooting for all of you and nothing but happy when I read your good news. When I read bad news I feel awful. Bad news sucks, it shouldn't exist and we should fucking abolish it.
We are sorta kinda in limbo again. DH is having trouble getting the urologist on the phone..but our plan right now is to get genetic testing done, talk again with him about clomid/other meds that might possibly increase his counts, and keep talking donor.
Well this sure reminds me of where we have been several times this last year.
Love you all. One of these days I'm gonna read through everyone's posts.
We are sorta kinda in limbo again. DH is having trouble getting the urologist on the phone..but our plan right now is to get genetic testing done, talk again with him about clomid/other meds that might possibly increase his counts, and keep talking donor.
Well this sure reminds me of where we have been several times this last year.
Love you all. One of these days I'm gonna read through everyone's posts.
Monday, January 3, 2011
Fml
Edited to add: I was very upset when I wrote this but I still want to post it. It was written on my blackberry and I debated whether or not to post it. Because I view this blog as a diary of sorts I want to remember these feelings. I think me and my husband will be okay, but things aren't better yet.
Written 1/1/11 8:04 am
I am mid flight right now from visiting family on the east coast for the new year. My face is red, blotchy, my eyes are swollen, I have mascara all over my face, my nose is stopped up and I am getting sympathetic glances from a soldier in the next aisle. Yep, I'm crying. I'm so frustrated right now that if I wasn't on a plane I'd go outside and yell "Fuck me" as loud as I possibly could.
Fuck me fuck me fuck me fuck me.
I seriously just hate this fucking bitch called hope. And it's starting to make me resent the one person I thought I could count on because he is the one who keeps offering hope and then seemingly snatching it back.
He keeps telling me to be sympathetic, to be sensitive to his feelings. But I'm not a fucking mind reader and I'm sick to fucking death of his changing his mind.
It all started when I told him today that we should narrow down our choices and decide on a donor in the next 1-2 weeks to ensure that everything is there on time and there are no problems. Suddenly I'm "pressuring him" and being "stressful".
He says, "Maybe we'll try this month, maybe we won't" all casually.
Fuck fuck fuck.
See I thought when he said he was ready, he was ready. EXCUSE me for not reading into that statement all sensitively and understandingly. EXCUSE me for actually taking what he said at face value.
He asked me if any husbands in this situation that I've read about have ever had second thoughts. I said of course but not usually after they finally come to the decision...but that I'd read of one couple in which the husband actually changed his mind in the REs office right before the insemination. He said he completely understands that because you never know how you'll feel until you're in that moment. I am in no fucking way gonna do this and be wondering at the last minute if he's gonna back out.
I just can't stop crying and my face is chapped from the shitty airline napkins.
We are pretty much giving each other the silent treatment.
God I don't know what to do but I know I can't do this for much longer.
The best part? He asked me how I'd feel if we are never able to have kids. I said, "I'd probably be okay but I would be sad for the rest of my life." He then said I should go back to counseling. OOOOH I never thought of that. Counseling! Of course! They will make it better. I bet I won't want kids at all after talking to them! What a genius fucking idea Einstein fuck face.
I wish to God this had never happened to us. We are not any closer for it. I am so filled with sorrow right now. Hate is even sneaking in there. I feel so awful.
I might take a break from blogging. I'm at the end of my rope right now.
Written 1/1/11 8:04 am
I am mid flight right now from visiting family on the east coast for the new year. My face is red, blotchy, my eyes are swollen, I have mascara all over my face, my nose is stopped up and I am getting sympathetic glances from a soldier in the next aisle. Yep, I'm crying. I'm so frustrated right now that if I wasn't on a plane I'd go outside and yell "Fuck me" as loud as I possibly could.
Fuck me fuck me fuck me fuck me.
I seriously just hate this fucking bitch called hope. And it's starting to make me resent the one person I thought I could count on because he is the one who keeps offering hope and then seemingly snatching it back.
He keeps telling me to be sympathetic, to be sensitive to his feelings. But I'm not a fucking mind reader and I'm sick to fucking death of his changing his mind.
It all started when I told him today that we should narrow down our choices and decide on a donor in the next 1-2 weeks to ensure that everything is there on time and there are no problems. Suddenly I'm "pressuring him" and being "stressful".
He says, "Maybe we'll try this month, maybe we won't" all casually.
Fuck fuck fuck.
See I thought when he said he was ready, he was ready. EXCUSE me for not reading into that statement all sensitively and understandingly. EXCUSE me for actually taking what he said at face value.
He asked me if any husbands in this situation that I've read about have ever had second thoughts. I said of course but not usually after they finally come to the decision...but that I'd read of one couple in which the husband actually changed his mind in the REs office right before the insemination. He said he completely understands that because you never know how you'll feel until you're in that moment. I am in no fucking way gonna do this and be wondering at the last minute if he's gonna back out.
I just can't stop crying and my face is chapped from the shitty airline napkins.
We are pretty much giving each other the silent treatment.
God I don't know what to do but I know I can't do this for much longer.
The best part? He asked me how I'd feel if we are never able to have kids. I said, "I'd probably be okay but I would be sad for the rest of my life." He then said I should go back to counseling. OOOOH I never thought of that. Counseling! Of course! They will make it better. I bet I won't want kids at all after talking to them! What a genius fucking idea Einstein fuck face.
I wish to God this had never happened to us. We are not any closer for it. I am so filled with sorrow right now. Hate is even sneaking in there. I feel so awful.
I might take a break from blogging. I'm at the end of my rope right now.
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