What the hell, right?

So I have 6 boxes of Clearblue Easy ovualtion predictor kits.  I noticed the other day that they expire this September so for the fun of it I used it this month.  It's the nice kind with the smiley face when you get your LH surge.  I was inordinately happy to get the smiley face.  I think just the positive reinforcemnt on a pee stick is good for the soul. LOL.  We did the BD at the appropriate time, I even elevated my hips afterward.  I got the giggles while doing so.  It reminded me of being a 27 year-old, naive newlywed.  This June will not only be our 5 year wedding anniversary, it will be 5 years since we pulled the goalie.  And in all that time the only pregnancies were after IVF.  You'd really think a 5mil/ml sperm count would be enough after 5 years of unprotected, relatively young sex wouldn't you?  So clearly this is just for fun and I doubt anything will come of it.  But hey it's free.  And I love the smiley face.

I'm also taking prenatals, fish oil, and have recently started eating pescetarian (no meat except seafood, hoping it lowers my slightly above normal cholesterol but also read it increases fertility?).  We are talking about DH maybe seeing a urologist here for a second opinion.  4 years ago when he first saw one the only real option was clomid.  I've read a lot lately about arimidex and injections of some sort.

As I end this rambling, short, TMI post I wonder why I wrote it?  I guess it just feels wrong to do anything in the TTC realm without sharing with the interwebz.  

Great day! I slept in (14 hours straight!!!!!!!!!!  I haven't slept like that since before the baby), DH and I just went on a 3.2 mile run, and we are going out to eat tonight while the in-laws babysit.  We have no family in town so when they visit we take advantage of the free baby-sitting!

While we were out on our run I was telling DH about a blog I read through recently (can't remember which one it was, lately I have been reading through blogs like novels) and a man with a low sperm count went on arimidex and his testosterone and sperm counts went up dramatically....I kind of wish I hadn't told him because now he thinks maybe we should postpone IVF and go back to the urologist and talk about that.  I say we go forward with IVF and use the arimidex possible miracle as a back up plan. Anyone have any information on arimidex??

Oh and I got a new job this week!  Next fall I will officially be an adjunct professor!  SO FANCY!  Really it is just teaching two 5 week courses of medical terminology online to healthcare IT students.  I will still be working as an ER nurse but this will allow me to make some money from home...and who knows, maybe lead me down a new career path?

I hope everyone is having a great weekend.

A long night

So I have been doing fancy schmancy google searches all night long and am now even more confused.

Dr. Silber in St. Louis is a world renown RE...you may remember him from an infertility special a few years ago about couples going through IVF...it airs sometimes still on TLC.  His website (http://www.infertile.com/) states...

There is no more confused medical care in our field than what is delivered by many urologists to the couple that suffers from "male infertility." In fact, many couples are told to delay the IVF treatment they should have had sooner (because of the wife's advancing age) in order just to wait for some dubious treatment of the male partner to increase his sperm count. Numerous control studies have demonstrated that administering clomid or nutritional supplements to the male does nothing to improve his sperm count, and the often suggested testosterone supplements just lowers rather than raises his sperm count, and may even render him totally sterile.

So what is appropriate treatment for male infertility in an infertile couple? For most men with low sperm counts, there is no treatment which will raise the sperm count, since sperm counts are genetically determined. It is best in cases of low sperm count to go directly to IVF and ICSI (which is injecting sperm into the egg) before the wife becomes so old that her older eggs become a compounding problem. Many physicians will try IUI first, intra-uterine insemination, but this is a waste of time and money. Washing the sperm and inserting it into the uterus will do nothing to get the sperm closer to the egg than sexual intercourse, although it may help the patients to feel like they are "doing something." The correct treatment for low sperm count is to go directly to IVF and ICSI.

Hmm.  So maybe 6 months of clomid is a waste of time.

Also, does anyone know anything about mini-ivf?  It is supposedly cheaper, produces less but higher quality eggs, and reduces the risk of multiples.

Dr Silber explains it in easy terms...

Think of this simple parable: If you are sitting under an apple tree, and wish to eat the most ripe and ready apples, you have a choice. You can chop down the tree, and look at every apple on the fallen tree to see which ones were ready. Or you can simply try to shake the lower branches and eat the one or two that have fallen. That is the idea of mini-IVF. For many patients, it will remove much of the aggravation and complexity associated with IVF, and also dramatically reduce the cost. But it requires a great deal of sophisticated ability to do well.

All of this information comes after research into antioxidants therapy and improving sperm counts (some studies show improvement, others don't) and state by state infertility insurance.

Here is a question.  If we move to a new state in the next couple of years and suddenly have health insurance that includes some sort of infertility treatment, would our male factor be considered a pre-existing condition and not be covered?

Always questions, always.  Thanks for helping!

Why can't we just talk like grown-ups?

Good news!  DH got his genetic tests back and all is well!  Normal karotype, no Y micro-deletion, no Klinefelters.  And so far...no discernible reason for his low sperm count/low to normal testosterone.  So WTF?  Why is it low? WHY WHY WHY?!?!?

So, I suppose this means no donor sperm, at least not yet.  It will be moved to the backburner for now and reserved as more of a back-up option. 

DH and I 'talked' this morning about things.  I use quotes because really a lot of it was what I call yelling.  He says he wasn't yelling, I said I wasn't crying (we were on the phone), we were both lying.  We were both happy that the genetic tests were normal, of course.  We've agreed we need a sit down with Dr P (urologist).  DH said when they talked a few weeks ago he was recommending 6 months of clomid and another drug he couldn't remember (Started with an M?  DH thought it was something like misoprop-something?  Anybody have a clue?).  He said it would take 6-8 months to see any changes.  Then we re-evaluate and see if we can get numbers up enough to do IUI or (shocker!) intercourse.  Seriously, we have been so knee-deep in infertility shit that the thought of having a child from sex seems laughable.  That's something that only happens in the movies, right? ;)

If that doesn't work then it is IVF.  So then the money talk began.  That's when we always have our fun.  I am pro baby, no matter the expense.  DH is pro-waiting for God knows how long until we are financially stable.

Now I agree with most of what he says.  I wouldn't want to put 20k on the credit card for IVF.  Duh, that seems stupid.  BUT I think in 9 months to a year we could save up maybe 10k...and I think then going into 10k debt for a 3 cycle plus option is fine. OR we could just do one cycle at around 7-8k and hope for the best.  We could definitely have that in 6-12 mos. 

THEN DH says, "Let's just wait until we move and try to get a job in a state that has infertility coverage".  Umm, we have talked about moving like 1 1/2-2 years from now, IF we can find jobs elsewhere and IF we can sell our house.  SO right there, 2 conditions that would have to be met for this to even have a chance of working.  And even then the coverage may not be as great as he thinks.  AND isn't there sometimes something like a time period before you can even use the benefits?  UUUGGHH!

I just know one day I will suddenly be 38, almost eggless, and we will still be talking about when it is right for IVF.

Sorry for the rant.  I am just SO fucking sick of infertility causing strife in my marriage.

tests

So we are still waiting for DH's test results.  He had genetic tests (unsure exactly but I know they were definitely looking for Klinefelter's and micro x deletion) and all the labs required for us to pursue donor sperm (it is so funny that they need his blood for that...it is to check him for all kinds of stds..I guess so that if one of us ended up with something from the sperm we would have proof that we didn't have it before?).

Does anyone know how long it takes to get these genetic tests back?  They were drawn early last week.

SO...I guess we have talked, if he has some genetic snafu then we will be able to move forward with ds with clearer heads.  I do completely agree with this.  Almost every blog I read about ds the man has NO or almost no sperm.  DH has sperm, albeit not many and those that are there are lazy.  But they're there.  So maybe if everything checks out with hubby's genetic makeup it would be silly not to move forward with IVF. 

Anyway, just checking in.  Here's to a fertile spring and summer 2011 for everyone!!!!

Questions..

I swear I've asked most of these before but bear with me..I have a few random questions and a few random thoughts..

1. I have read about clomid increasing sperm counts and sometimes motility.  I have also read however that it does not necessarily improve pregnancy rates.  Why is this?  Any success stories with actual numbers?
2. Reasons for such a low sperm count in DH...physical exam was normal, testosterone slightly low, unsure if any other hormones were tested.  Genetic testing next...exactly what tests should be ordered?  How long do they take to get back? What do the results mean?
3. HOW THE HELL DOES ANYONE EVER AFFORD IVF?
4. ahem.  That last one should probably read, "How will we ever be able to afford it?".  Seriously?  Why is it so expensive?
5. I just read online about a new study showing taking extra antioxidants improves sperm count and function.  Anyone know anything about this?  There are about a million antioxidant supplements out there. 
6. Ummm I have just started to have an interest in adoption.  DH has a cousin or friend or someone he knows who had a bad experience and he has said from the beginning, "I just am not comfortable adopting."  Do you think that statement is open for discussion or should I just shut the fuck up for now and cross that bridge later if we need to?

DH just got back from a work trip today.  I haven't yet asked him if he has heard back from the urology dr for the genetic work-up.  Serisouly this is pissing me off.  Well 2 things are...that the dr can't make the time to write a stupid lab order and secondly that I feel guilty asking DH yet again if he has heard.  It is so not his fault that this dr is so busy...but whenever I ask him he feels that I am pressuring him.  I know he's stressed, I get that.  Work and phd stuff has been crazy lately. 

I am just so sick of all of this.  If the fates have decided that we are not meant to have children at all then I just want to know now. I don't want to keep googling things like, "adoption agencies" "ivf success rates" "genetic reasons for low sperm counts" "donor sperm psychological implications" "ivf financing" "antioxidant sperm production" "hormonal reasons for low sperm count". 

Limbo, how I've missed you

First off I am SOOO far behind on blogs.  I have only read sporadically...I am sorry.  I am rooting for all of you and nothing but happy when I read your good news. When I read bad news I feel awful.  Bad news sucks, it shouldn't exist and we should fucking abolish it.

We are sorta kinda in limbo again.  DH is having trouble getting the urologist on the phone..but our plan right now is to get genetic testing done, talk again with him about clomid/other meds that might possibly increase his counts, and keep talking donor. 

Well this sure reminds me of where we have been several times this last year. 

Love you all.  One of these days I'm gonna read through everyone's posts. 

Clomid for men?

We got a letter in the mail today from Dr P (that is so not an original nickname for a urologist is it?) that was kind of a summary of where we are.  We FINALLY got DH's exact second SA and testosterone results from late April:

1.7 cc total
5.2 million per cc
Motility 20%
3% shaped normally.

Now this to me seems to me like a marked improvement over his first SA 4 weeks prior to that -

1.5 cc total
4 million per cc
Motility 10%
0% shaped normally.

Also his testosterone went from around 180 up to 285 (I think anything above 300 is normal).

SO...what now?

Dr P says that we could try putting DH on clomid for 3 months and then retesting...I guess it is known to sometimes improve SA numbers...BUT research doesn't prove why.  So putting my husband on a medicine that causes mood swings (god help me if his moods become any more unstable) and hot flashes to possibly improve numbers in some unknown way?  Is this wise?

Does anyone have any information or experience in this matter?  And are these numbers really so awful that I can't hope for a surprise pregnancy some time?  Or at least to hope to get things good enough for iui and avoid the expense and toil of IVF?

Well hello there...

Hi!  I'm new to blogging but so not new to lurking on other people's blogs.  Ever since it became apparent that pregnancy wasn't going to happen easily I went where every woman goes to research...Google.  I am obsessed with googling things.  When we first started ttc I googled things like, "early pregnancy symptoms", "how often should we have to sex to get pregnant?", "is alcohol intake harmful before implantation?" (this one was done a few times the last few months we were trying naturally..I got really sick of not drinking 50% of the time).  Luckily google directed me to an infertility blog.  Now I am a blog addict.  It seems like everyone around me gets pregnant super easily, it was a relief to find out I am not alone.

We are now trying to decide between using donor sperm for an IUI or saving up money for an IVF attempt.  Dr P is concerned that DH may have a genetic variant that is causing his low sperm count and low testosterone so that is making us lead toward donor.  In the next couple of months we plan on getting DH's labs repeated including a genetic work up,  I will have an HSG and saving money!!  Also I have implemented a healthy lifestyle...I have quit drinking alcohol, quit drinking diet sodas, and am trying to lose weight through calorie counting and exercise.

Thanks for reading!